May 24, 2022

China Anon's 3rd Message to Submarine Manners

To Arpit Kanodi [May 16-17, 2022 comments and Submarine Matters readers

 generally
] China Anons says: 

[1]  "Firstly, if you are living in China, then you be cleared by CCP to post comments here (and somewhat blame CCP to again make a good image in Australian minds, after disastrous policies) after seeing the multi-national nature of this blog."

I have nothing to do with the government, Arpit. If you view China as a country where the government micromanages every single person, you are bound to see China as evil and alien entity. And call me thin-skinned but I also find it insulting since it plays into that stereotype that describes the Chinese people as robots. I would advise you to visit China for a few days after the border opens again to foreigners. Your views would probably change.

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[2]  "If you think these are not patronizing, then I must say, CCP indoctrinated you well. The fall of the CCP is guaranteed, the policies they adopted is unsustainable, and Xi Jinping is nothing but Brezhnev 2.0 and but far more stupider. "

Yes, those are the scenarios the PLA prepares for, Taiwan contingency being the most prominent by a huge margin. And CCP is not going to fall anytime soon. Ethnic fault lines that destroyed the USSR don't exist in China, and 70 years of success makes the CCP hugely popular in China. This "CCP will fall soon" was an empty hope by Western governments throughout the last 70 years. And I would say it benefited China.

Taiwan rejected the extremely lopsided reunification offer of Deng Xiaoping. Read about it. The PRC offered even editing the flag and the name of the country. Taiwan was going to keep its military and foreign affairs. [??] All PRC wanted was an official declaration of sovereignty of the PRC in Taiwan. De facto independence would continue and they would get a permanent representative in the mainland's gov. They didn't accept. They didn't declare independence during those years while they can either. KMT was probably hoping for the CCP's collapse so then they could return to the mainland politics.

Clinton and [Presidents George W? or George H W?] Bush tried to influence China through trade. The ultimate goal was obviously adding China to the US-led global order. The US was probably also hoping for the Westernization of China, which would allow substantial US political and cultural influence on China. They thought it would happen inevitably since the CCP had to lose grip. Didn't happen. Chinese people didn't Westernize and the CCP was popular among the public. I think the US would be a lot more forceful against China during the 1990s and 2000s if it knew China wouldn't become a deputy sheriff in the US-led order.

CCP's collapse is an empty hope. It is here to stay.

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[3]  "For J-20 don't make me laugh, in 4-5 years Pentagon leaked out exaggerated reports, for lobbies and think tanks to pressurize on US Govt. And gullible Chinese believe it? Right now, several aspects of J-20 is not even 4th gen, leave alone 5th gen. And there is nothing OpSec in J-20 that Ruskies don't know about." 

You can laugh as much as you can. The J-20 is 5th gen. I could go on and write and write a jingoistic breakdown here but I won't. 

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[4]  "The Chinese are investing with Russians because they are even far behind the Russians in these technologies. " 

It is not that simple. Russia has experience in enacting early warning systems that monitor a massive area and that can work synchronously with their extremely varied nuclear arsenal. Israel has no such experience. Their country is tiny and their nuclear arsenal is very small. And as I said Russian and Chinese systems will work together for maximum geographical coverage. If we are talking about just radars China is ahead of everyone except the USA. For example where is the Israeli equivalent of JY-27A or SLC-7 [longe range early warning radars]?

Or where is Type 346's [naval AESA radars - see 346B variant] equivalent? The same goes for satellites too. Where is the equivalent of GF-11 and GF-13 [Chinese reconnaissance satellites] in Israel, Russia or India?

6 comments:

Anonymous said...

Pete

Thanks, another interesting comment. I will leave most of the detailed comments to others. However I found this comment extraordinary:
“ Ethnic fault lines that destroyed the USSR don't exist in China,”

I am no expert but unless every book I have read on China is wrong, this comment is far from the truth. China is no more a single harmonious culture than Europe is; far less so. Internal conflicts have been the primary cause of the end of different dynasties in Chinese history, especially those between northern and southern Chinese dynasties.

There are conflicts between north and south, mountains and plain, city and rural, and of course the persecution of the Uighurs. Then there are the various internal suppressions of opposition carried out by the CCP including but not limited to the cultural revolution. So there are both ethnic and social fault lines in China that have been violent in the past. See
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism_in_China

GhalibKabir said...

Hi Anon@Shanghai (based on IP trace)

Quick answers

1. India equivalent of Gaofen 11/JianBing 16 can be found in the Cartosats which is basically IMINT while the RISAT series gives us Radar IMINT with high end X-Band SAR. SIGINT is limited to one ELINT sat called EMISAT with 2-3 more planned (like JSSW-3 or DQ-1 of China)

Your needs are bigger, India only needs a few for regional cover on pakistan and china. Quantity and Quality wise China may be ahead, but India is steadily trying to enhance ability.

https://cenjows.in/test/pdf/Monograph-Lt-Col-Vivek-Gopal.pdf

China's capabilities are well studied too. Space and increasingly electronics (radar, missiles etc.) is one place steady attempt is there in India to stay relevant in capability terms. you will be surprised to know the likely chinese stereotype of indians as talking too much and doing little might not be exactly accurate.

2. Quick answer is our Type-346 AESA is the MF-STAR or ELM 2248, now planned to be replaced with 2248 derived Indianized LR-MFR AESA to guide OTH and CEC enabled Brahmos, Nirbhay and Barak-8ERs.

3. India's closest equivalents of the JY-27A is the 2084 MMR and also the Green pine (Arrow 3 radar) derived Swordfish (this is more for BMD and long range air defense though)

Again, it is a pity that china has chosen to frame India as a big talking enemy and refuses to offer a mutually helpful border solution and keeps making maximalist claims and insulting india pointlessly.

Pete said...

Hi Anonymous [at May 24, 2022, 10:11:00 PM]

No countries seem innocent of racism and killing of minorities. So much would go unreported.

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Of course current US anti-African American killing is no great record either. Much goes unreported or distorted by police to avoid prosecution https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=traffic+stop+police+shoots+in+the+back

Also lucky China does not have a Citizen's Right to Bear Arms Consitutional Amendment resulting in "About 1.4 million people have died from firearms in the U.S. between 1968 and 2011."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violence_against_Muslims_in_India

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Slaughter of Australian Aborigines before WWII was terrible and almost always unreported.

Anonymous said...

Pete

Of course I agree there is racism in every country, including Australia. I was responding to China Anon's remark's that seemed to imply it was not a problem in China, which is obviously false.

Further the news today of China's draft five year action plan with 10 Pacific Island countries (not only the Solomons) clearly shows that China is aggressively pursuing a policy to become regionally dominant, not merely a development participant. The failure of Australian governments not to respond to this sooner looks very regrettable.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-05-25/china-seeks-pacific-islands-policing-security-cooperation/101099978

Pete said...

You're right Anonymous [at May 26, 2022, 2:38:00 PM]

1. Check out this commercial of a black guy getting "clothes" washed by a Chinese lass. He pops out as a more PRC acceptable light skinned Han Chinese https://youtu.be/Few8kJ0zfnY .

2. And China is not only racist, but Class Ridden by Law
ie. those in the Communist Party Class rule over the great Majority of non-Party members.

3. Yes thanks for https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-05-25/china-seeks-pacific-islands-policing-security-cooperation/101099978
I've been working on the new article today https://gentleseas.blogspot.com/2022/05/chinas-10-pacific-island-nation.html

If China buys or invades lots of islnds it might one day catch up with the old British or Current American Empire.

Still it is the American Empire that nuclear protects our good selves.

Regards Pete

Anonymous said...

Much as I would like to live long enough to see Nuke submarines for RAN. There is the matter of RatBag regiems. I find it difficult to accomadate their gross coruption and the greed for Chinese money. The list of these dictators is becoming alarming to me, they're not feeding their people food, no they use force and punishment against anyone, especially groups who demonstrate the slightest attempts towards a democracy. The list of RatBags regiems continues to grow. I do have questions to consider: Why does China believe they must outgrow the US in military strength? Russia too have fear that the US is preparing to wipe the floor with them; hence their expenditure for weapons of mass destruction as well as misiles ICBM's most dangerous of all. From my little patch, I think we could do a lot better in this region. The shock of a Chinese pact with the Solomon Island should be a wake-up call for all the regio.
While Putin desroys Ukraine and China is building a series of airstrips and ports for their fishing boats and others. I'm hoping a few dictators will call it 'enough' and vanish. Unfortunely, there's always another RatBag waiting their chance. The Human Condition I suppose.