Canada may be deciding next week or next month which of the two submarine types (built by TKMS and Hanwha Ocean) its going to chose.
Even though a German/Norwegian TKMS Type 212CD has not evens been launched there is more certainty about its design (particularly it not having a Vertical Launch Systems (VLS) and its displacement being (right sidebar) 2,500 tonnes (surfaced) and 2,800 tonnes (submerged). Also (right sidebar) are two torpedo tube launched missiles under consideration - being the likely Tomahawk sized anti-ship and land attack NSM-SL,[20] and likely Harpoon sized - for anti-ship only 3SM Tyrfing[21][22]
It is about the other contender, the already launched South Korean KSS-III Batch-Is or Batch-IIs that there is more uncertainty. This is because Canadian officials and the military leadership have not officially stated whether Canada wants VLS in the KSS-III.
VLS may weigh up to 800 tonnes. So VLS or no VLS is an issue impacting the KSS-III's whole design, including every buoyancy and trim calculation.
Complicating the KSS-III Batch-I or II picture are two never built "Export variants" of the KSS-III, that don't come with VLS. They are known as the DSME-2000 (2,000 tonnes) and DSME-3000 ("3,300 tonnes") (the KSS-III Batch-I is 3,305 tonnes (surfaced). In terms of length the DSME-3000 design is "83.5 meters" as is the KSS-III Batch-I.
If Canada picks a KSS-III it may be a Batch-I (with VLS) already operational or a DSME-3000 paper design - with the same dimensions, but without VLS.
A KSS-III Batch-I or II with 6 or 10 VLS for missiles may be seen as an encumbrance given Canadian submarines' projected (?) standard mission profile of quiet surveillance.
Comparing their structure and operation for degree of discretion relies on data that would only be available after an at sea runoff in 10 years time - data that would be, in any case, highly classified.
Comparing the DSME-3000 design's 3,300 tonnes and 83.5 metres exceeding the Type 212CD design's 2,500 tonne and 73 metres equals 800 tonnes and 10.5 metres greater. This may contribute to:
Improved speed, range and endurance of the DSME-3000; more diesel fuel; larger AIP machinery more AIP chemicals; more Lithium-ion Batteries; a greater electrical load for more powerful sensors and processing power; more food, space and comfort for a mixed gender crew; on longer patrols; and, more heavyweight torpedo tube fired shots (torpedoes, missiles, mines and UUVs and remotely operated seafloor sensor/IUSS maintenance robots).
But again, NATO alliance solidarity may trump South Korea's larger, likely more capable design. Canada might decide on the winning sub before NATO's July 7-8, 2026 NATO Summit, to be held in Ankara, Turkiye.
9 comments:
Hi Pete,
I reckon VLS in submarines is not a critical feature for many navies. As you mentioned, a VLS module adds a significant percentage of displacement onto a boat, which would be 'unless ballast' in normal patrol operations.
The South Koreans have VLS-equipped submarines for their three-axis system to counter North Korea, basically their version of MAD:
https://www.chosun.com/english/opinion-en/2026/06/10/TLQIKNARVVBBHEBR45CBN4YTFU/
It's very hard for the NK (and Russia) to detect an SSB AIP boat loitering in the Sea of Japan (or an SK SSBN in 2035).
Canada has no strategic requirement for an SLBM, but has stated the requirement to launch "long-range cruise missiles" in their formal CPSP RFI, but this can be achieved with missiles launched from conventional torpedo tubes, such as the Tomahawk (no longer in production), Haeseong III, FC/ASW, MdCN or JSM-SL.
https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2025/06/maritime-strike-joint-strike-missile-as-armament-for-type-212cd-submarines/
Enlarging the "torpedo handling room" is a more versatile solution, as it enhances the ability of a submarine to carry and launch mines, UUVs, diver vehicles, and other systems.
Note for the sake of comparison, the Singapore Invincible-class Type 218SG submarines are officially stated to be equipped with eight 533mm torpedo tubes, but there are a few reports that include "two larger 650mm tubes for multi mission use", a feature the Israeli Dolphin II class is also rumored to use.
Hi Shawn at 6/25/2026 7:58 PM
Yes only South Korean definitely have VLS SSB/SSCs and Israel is suspected to have them https://gentleseas.blogspot.com/search?q=dakar - the latter even having nuclear warheads!
The Russo-Ukraine war, "NATO First", and Iranian responses to the US-Israel-Iranian war has sped up development of horizontal launch SLCMs. Many are here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submarine-launched_missile#Submarine-launched_cruise_missiles
Canada has been a non adopter of SLCMs - with none in all torpedo/mine Oberons and Victoria SSKs. This may be explained by Canada's main use of subs for monitoring: from Latin American and Caribbean anti-drug smuggling; northern oceans surveillance (mainly against Russia but anti-US would be increasingly justified); new doctrine for mines; existing fixed sensor/IUSS and training-interaction with NATO navies against Russian ships and SSKs; and new UUV warfare.
Canada would be unlikely to need ready use VL missiles in all of this. Torpedo tubed SLCMs for anti-ship would be adequate. Canada would probably prefer the US, UK and French SSNs lead the way with VLS land attack responses to Russia, China and NK.
218SGs having "two larger 650mm tubes"? Singapore's long contact with Israel (suspected of using some 650s) may favour the 218sg's 650 use for special forces diver swim out and in.
Cheers Pete
Hi Pete,
The Singapore military is usually obscure about weapons system capabilities, but eight are officially listed (note 2019 press release)
https://www.mindef.gov.sg/news-and-events/latest-releases/18feb19_fs/
I cannot find a clear image of the submarine class's bow, but the images I have seen appear to indicate eight tubes. Note that there is a large rectangular panel on the port side (see first image) that is not present on the starboard, so I assume this is an ROV/UUV/diver lockout
https://www.nationthailand.com/news/asean/40037452
Are these submarines equipped with 650mm torpedo tubes? I believe this is a speculative "fact" that was picked up and repeated by defence media, such as: https://www.asiapacificdefensejournal.com/2024/09/singapore-commissions-two-new.html
Socceroos reached World Cup's knockout stages, where they will face the second of GroupG. As Group G is weak, Socceroos can become best 16, congraturations.
Hi Shawn at 6/26/2026 5:20 PM
I see https://www.asiapacificdefensejournal.com/2024/09/singapore-commissions-two-new.html as indeed "speculative" when it talks of Type 218SG's as "believed to be equipped with eight forward-firing 533mm and two 650mm torpedo tubes." That's 10 torpedo tubes.
Another possibility occurred to me that instead of 650s, 218 my have just one larger (say 1 metre) horizontal multi-purpose lock (HMPL).
Please scroll one quarter way down this Saab A26 website https://www.saab.com/products/5th-generation-submarine with one such HMPL ejecting an XLUUV - with the description
"Seabed warfare - Controlling critical sea lines of communication and protecting friendly forces requires a submarine that can interact with the seabed with system-of-systems capabilities, facilitating the strategic deployment of UUVs and special forces."
Sweden's XLUUV may be the Saab "larger uncrewed underwater vehicle (LUUV)" https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2025/08/saab-to-develop-luuv-large-autonomous-submarine-for-sweden/
Or IF? the 218SG has a 1 meter HMPL then perhaps Singapore is investing in Australia's circular diameter "Speartooth" XLUUV project - at 1m diameter https://c2robotics.com.au/products/speartooth/ ?
Cheers Pete
Thanks Anonymous at 6/26/2026 9:44 PM
Australia's "Socceroos will be in action on Saturday, July 4 AEDT, when Australia takes on Egypt['s "Pharaohs"] who are playing in their first-ever knockout game at the World Cup finals." at https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-06-28/world-cup-who-plays-in-the-round-of-32-what-time/106851976
With Egypt (2.50) slightly ahead of Australia (3.60) in the betting odds https://www.sportsbet.com.au/betting/soccer/world-cup/mens-world-cup/australia-v-egypt-10642345
I'm betting France will win the WC overall https://www.google.com/search?q=odds+of+winning+the+world+cup+2026&sca_esv=21a1cac05cdae795&biw=1280&bih=598&sxsrf=APpeQnvT3cqk9lPcsewY6dFnnJvew1ZCkg%3A1782632101418&ei=pc5AauX-GImovr0P2YbJ4AU&ved=0ahUKEwil5a2JtqmVAxUJlK8BHVlDElwQ4dUDCBI&uact=5&oq=odds+of+winning+the+world+cup+2026&gs_lp=Egxnd3Mtd2l6LXNlcnAiIm9kZHMgb2Ygd2lubmluZyB0aGUgd29ybGQgY3VwIDIwMjYyBRAAGIAEMgYQABgWGB4yBhAAGBYYHjIGEAAYFhgeMgYQABgWGB4yBhAAGBYYHjIGEAAYFhgeMgYQABgWGB4yBhAAGBYYHjIGEAAYFhgeSIOvAlDtMljkpQJwAXgAkAEAmAGkAqABjXKqAQcwLjIwLjQ2uAEDyAEA-AEBmAInoAKxQ8ICChAAGEcY1gQYsAPCAgcQIxiwAhgnwgIIEAAYgAQYogTCAggQABiJBRiiBMICBRAAGO8FwgIEEAAYA8ICBhAAGAMYDcICCxAAGIAEGIoFGIYDwgIEECEYCsICChAhGAoYoAEYwwTCAggQIRigARjDBJgDAIgGAZAGCJIHBjEuOS4yOaAH6NACsgcGMC45LjI5uAeqQ8IHBzEuMTguMjDIB3yACAE&sclient=gws-wiz-serp
Cheers Pete
Hi Pete,
Saab (vias Kockums and Bofors) have a long relationship with Singapore MINDEF, and are the primary contractor for Singapore's MRCV project, which means that they been talking to Singapore's Defense Science and Technology Agency (DSTA) for decades, signing an MoU for "underwater defense technilogy" a year before Saab was selected to lead NATO's Allied Underwater Battlespace Mission Newtork (AUWB-MN).
https://www.saab.com/newsroom/press-releases/2024/saab-and-dsta-deepen-partnership-to-drive-innovation-in-underwater-technologies
Saab has a number of underwater drones that the Singapore Navy would find 'interesting' - but the Autonomous Ocean Drone is supposedly 1.4m in width and would not fit a 1m HMPL - though it could be launched from "piggy back". https://youtu.be/JDjwL1rfLYA?si=t3InLfOClAFBqrXN
This Saab AOD is smaller than Andruil's Ghost Shark XL-AUV, and probably better suited for the Andaman and South China Seas.
The RUMINT is that tomorrow (06 Jul/26) PM Carney will announced who the winner of the CPS Project.
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politics/article-canada-12-submarines-competition-to-be-announced-monday/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
Thanks Anonymous at 7/06/2026 8:04 AM
Hopefully this "RUMINT" proves correct. A dollar each way 50% : 50% bet, I reckon :)
Cheers Pete
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