Words from Ryan White and experts on Japanese submarines, wispywood2344 and Anonymous, are on the Japanese Navy no longer building Soryu Mk.1s, commissioning the Soryu Mk.2s (JS Oryu and Toryu - the last Soryus) and bulding the follow-on Taigei-class.
The following is a summary of Ryan White's UK based Naval Post, on March 24, 2021, report:
"Japan
commissions JS Toryu, its Second Submarine Running on Li-Ion Batteries"
The Japanese Navy commissioned its 12th and
final Soryu-class sub, JS Toryu, at KHI's Kobe shipyard on March 24,
2021. Toryu is assigned to the 2nd Submarine Flotilla, Kure naval base.
Like the preceding Soryu-class sub JSS Oryu, Toryu use LIBs from GS Yuasa
with no Stirling AIP. The LIBs are lithium nickel cobalt aluminum oxide (NCA).
LIBs require less maintenance, have longer endurance or permit higher speed
compared to LABs. [See "Key to" the SORYU Table in
the article above for expansions of all these acronyms.]
[Pete Comment: Soryu subs are budgeted by the
Japanese Finance Ministry in Japanese Yen and may average the equivalent of
US$550 million for the longterm and only customer, the Japanese Navy. Export
prices would be much higher with the need for risk, technology transfer and
profit margins. JS Toryu itself cost around US$584 million, probably due to the
extra development and production costs of its LIBs.].
Specs for the Soryu include: 84m long, 9.1m
beam, 2,900 tonnes (surfaced), 4,200 tonnes (submerged), 65 crew.
Max range 6,100nm at 6.5kn. 2 x 12V25/25SB Kawasaki diesels.
6 x 533mm torpedo tubes for Type 89 torpedoes,
UGM-84 Harpoon AShMs and mines.
_____________
Note: Naval
Post is a UK
based online defence media company, focused on Warships,
Submarines, Naval Air, Marines, Coast Guard, and Naval Missiles. It started in
2016 with the name of “Naval News”. In 2021 it changed its name to Naval
Post.
_____________
On March 28, 2021
wispywood2344 (very knowledgable about Japanese submarines) provided a
link and comments: which suggests:
Toryu's sonar system
"ZQQ-7E" has progressed from Oryu's "ZQQ-7D-2" in the following
ways;
A) Improved acoustic
signal processing algorithms
B) Improved mechanical
strength [level of breaking strain] of the TASS [= Towed
Array Sonar System ]
The latter is worthy of
note, because it strongly suggests an increase in patrol speed.
wispwood2344 concludes
that one of the reasons why the Japanese Navy ("JMSDF") abandoned AIP
and LABs and then adopted LIBs may be to expand the hourly patrol area by
increasing the patrol speed.
AIP on Soryu Mk.1s allows
14 days continuous diving at inadequate speeds of 4kt or less.
The fact that increased
patrol speed is one of the development goals of the sonar system currently
under development reinforces the speculation in this Japanese Ministry of
Defense (MoD) link "Reiwa02
administrative review ; Development of the future submarine sonar system.
"
Pete has translated parts
of it: "The submarine [Toryu] is scheduled to operate for about 24
years in the future, and during that period, it will collect information and
monitor over a wide area while maintaining its superiority in the underwater
area. In order to implement this, we will develop a sonar device that improves
the detection capability and ensures the ease of capacity improvement in
response to the improvement in patrol speed by towing....We will carry out
detailed design and trial production of the mold array, a part of the signal
processing unit and each component of the evaluation processing unit. In
addition, to conductingg technical tests we will conduct practical tests over
the fiscal year to verify the results."
This supports wispwood2344's
conclusions.
______________________
Anonymous (expert on
Japanese submarines) on March 29, 2021 commented,
to the effect:
As Stirling AIP generates-expels carbon dioxide into the surrounding seawater, the
efficiency of AIP becomes 0% at 20 atmospheric pressure (= 200m dive depth).
So, Stirling AIP must operate at much shallower depths - this might be an
irritating situation which may become serious if a Soryu Mk. 1 wanted to dive
(most quietly, using AIP) below 200m to avoid a threat.
Anonymous has also
advised in the past that the large liquid oxygen (LOx) tank that formed part of
Soryu Mk. 1's AIP system was a heavy weight (even when exmty) to carry
throughout a mission and then a declining-variable weight as LOx was consumed
with AIP use (all leading to buoyancy problems-complexity).
Stirling AIP's depth limitation, and buoyancy problems of AIP subs that rely on heavy-weight LOx, are some reasons for the removal of Stirling AIP from the Soryu Mk.1s.
Hi Pete
ReplyDeleteAccording to formal information of JMSDF, standard (surface) displacement of Toryu is 2950 ton, not 2900 ton [1].
[1] https://www.mod.go.jp/msdf/operation/meimei/r00/ Third table, second row
Regards
Hi Anonymous [at Mar 25, 2021, 9:03:00 PM]
ReplyDeleteRe: "According to formal information of JMSDF, standard (surface) displacement of Toryu is 2950 ton, not 2900 ton [1]. [1] https://www.mod.go.jp/msdf/operation/meimei/r00/ Third table, second row"
What troubled me is that the simple use of the word "ton" does not indicate which type of ton it means. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ton
In the UK the (Imperial) ton is defined as 1,016 kg. In the US and Canada, a ton is defined to be 907 kg. While a "tonne" is 1000 kg.
So how many kg in a Japanese "ton"?
Regards
Pete
Hi Pete (Mar 27, 2021, 8:36:00 AM)
ReplyDeleteOne tonne is 1000 kg (=metric tonne) in Japan Ministry of Defense [1, 2].
[1] Japan NDS (National Defense Standard) adopts SI (International System of Units).
[2] Tonne is none-SI units accepted for use with the SI units where one tonne is defined to be 1000kg
(https://www.bipm.org/utils/common/pdf/si-brochure/SI-Brochure-9-EN.pdf, page 145, Table 8)
Regards
Hi Anonymous [at Mar 27, 2021, 9:23:00 PM]
ReplyDeleteThank you for clarifying Japan's Ministry of Defense (MoD) uses the standard one metric tonne = 1,000kg measure.
It appears that the Wikipedia author, who changes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S%C5%8Dry%C5%AB-class_submarine may be looking at Submarine Matters comments, because he/she has helpfully (in late March) altered the right sidebar to indicate the Soryu-class' Displacement is:
"Surfaced: 2,900 tonnes"
and
"Submerged: 4,200 t[onnes = ] (4,134 long tons)"
Regards
Pete
Hi Pete.
ReplyDeleteAccording to the document on the website of the defense structure improvement foundation, the cathode of the japanese submarine LIB is "lithium cobalt oxide"(LCO).[1]
Considering the development period, technology trend of LIB and the author of the document (GS-YUASA & MHI), this discription is highly reliable.
However, as LCO is a different substance from NCA, this description contradicts the claim of retired Admiral Kobayashi.[2]
[1]https://ssl.bsk-z.or.jp/kenkyucenter/pdf/gyt20201210.pdf
*See Table1
[2]Kobayashi, Masao.(2017) "TODAY'S SUBMARINE 12" in Yasumitsu Takada(ed.), SHIPS OF THE WORLD vol.861, Tokyo:Kaijinsha Co.,Ltd, pp.104-109.
regards
wispywood2344
Hi Anonymous
ReplyDeleteAs your May 23, 2021, 11:26:00 PM comment directly relates to my new article:
"Usually Secret Japan Doc: LIBs for Subs: Code "SLH" is LCO" of May 24, 2021 at https://gentleseas.blogspot.com/2021/05/usually-secret-japanese-doc-on-libs-for.html
I have moved your comment to below https://gentleseas.blogspot.com/2021/05/usually-secret-japanese-doc-on-libs-for.html. Its now date-timed "May 24, 2021, 11:15:00 PM"
Kind Regards
Pete