There are so many inconguities concerning Brazil's offer of old Tupi Type 209 submarines to Argentina.
Brazil and Argentina, over the last decade and a half, have placed submarine building and maintenance as lower budgetary and political priorities than in previous decades when each country considered the other a strategic opponent.
Put another way, two decades ago there was a mild, ongoing, Brazilian-Argentine submarine arms race. This is no longer the case.
Hence Brazil has chosen a novel, but strangely logical, action of offering some the components of the past arms race (2 to 4 Brazilian submarines) to Argentina.
Aside from the old arms race Brazil's and Argentina's submarine forces are too weak to be seen as viable guardians of their national independence against nuclear submarine powers. Their submarine forces are simply too weak to be asymmetric responses to the overwhelming US and UK/Falkland nuclear submarine forces that patrol the South American region. Also the US defence forces have long countered major military threats to the "Western Hemisphere" which includes Argentina and Brazil.
Perhaps the only other serious owner of conventional submarines in South America is Chile, with 2 modern Scorpenes and 2 older Type 209s. Argentina shares a long land/sea border with Chile enjoying good relations.
The most valuable function of Latin American submarines may be anti-drugs and against other organised crime. But this does not make 1,000+ tonne submarines efficient or justifiable solutions.
Santiago Rivas, for Jane's Defence Weekly, June 10, 2019, reported
https://www.janes.com/article/89163/brazil-to-transfer-type-209-submarines-to-the-argentine-navy
BACKGROUND
Following ARA San Juan's accidental sinking in November 2017 Argentina's now has just one very old, semi-active submarine, ARA Santa Cruz, which was commissioned way back in 1984. In the following paragraphs Submarine Matters is directly citing some Portuguese-Brazilian language sources.
Meanwhile Brazil 5 Tupi class subs are reportedly non operational with S Tupi (commissioned 1989) being cannibalized for spare parts. Brazil's S Tikuna (S-34), arguably a Tupi, was commissioned in 2006, and may not be offered to Argentina. So far just one of Brazil’s new class of Scorpene submarines (S Riachuelo (S 40)) has been launched and even it may not be commissioned until 2023.
Given the sporadic state of repairs the 3 available Tupi's (S Tamoio (S-31) commissioned 1995, S Timbira (S-32) 1996 and S Tapajó (S-33) 1999) have aged quickly and are in need of extensive repairs and upgrades.
Argentina’s naval shipyard (Tandanor) chief Jorge Arosa (unlike other Argentine admirals and officials) is not enthusiastic about the Tupi deal as he believes the Tupis are far less capable/smaller than ARA Santa Cruz. Arosa also says he has is no idea of the true cost of repairing and refurbishing the Tupis.
Brazil and Argentina, over the last decade and a half, have placed submarine building and maintenance as lower budgetary and political priorities than in previous decades when each country considered the other a strategic opponent.
Put another way, two decades ago there was a mild, ongoing, Brazilian-Argentine submarine arms race. This is no longer the case.
“The creation
of the Union of South American Nations, in 2008, was a landmark in the new foreign
policies of Brazil and Argentina. [Earlier in] another sign of mutual trust,
since 2003, diplomats from both countries occupy a single seat in the United Nations Security Council
when either of them hold a non-permanent
seat.” There is Brazilian-Argentine military
cooperation across most areas.
Hence Brazil has chosen a novel, but strangely logical, action of offering some the components of the past arms race (2 to 4 Brazilian submarines) to Argentina.
Aside from the old arms race Brazil's and Argentina's submarine forces are too weak to be seen as viable guardians of their national independence against nuclear submarine powers. Their submarine forces are simply too weak to be asymmetric responses to the overwhelming US and UK/Falkland nuclear submarine forces that patrol the South American region. Also the US defence forces have long countered major military threats to the "Western Hemisphere" which includes Argentina and Brazil.
Perhaps the only other serious owner of conventional submarines in South America is Chile, with 2 modern Scorpenes and 2 older Type 209s. Argentina shares a long land/sea border with Chile enjoying good relations.
The most valuable function of Latin American submarines may be anti-drugs and against other organised crime. But this does not make 1,000+ tonne submarines efficient or justifiable solutions.
Santiago Rivas, for Jane's Defence Weekly, June 10, 2019, reported
https://www.janes.com/article/89163/brazil-to-transfer-type-209-submarines-to-the-argentine-navy
"The Brazilian Navy has agreed to
transfer two Tupi class submarines – Type 209/1400 – to Argentina, following a
meeting between Brazilian president Jair Bolsonaro and his Argentine
counterpart, Mauricio Macro.
The deal includes a potential
future transfer of an additional two boats. The first two could be
transferred during 2019 and the ships would then receive some "minor" repairs at
Tandanor shipyard in Argentina before entering service in 2020.
The Tupi class of four vessels
was commissioned between 1989 and 1999 and is slated to be replaced by the four
Tonelero-class submarines of the Scorpene type in the near future..."
BACKGROUND
Following ARA San Juan's accidental sinking in November 2017 Argentina's now has just one very old, semi-active submarine, ARA Santa Cruz, which was commissioned way back in 1984. In the following paragraphs Submarine Matters is directly citing some Portuguese-Brazilian language sources.
Given the sporadic state of repairs the 3 available Tupi's (S Tamoio (S-31) commissioned 1995, S Timbira (S-32) 1996 and S Tapajó (S-33) 1999) have aged quickly and are in need of extensive repairs and upgrades.
Argentina’s naval shipyard (Tandanor) chief Jorge Arosa (unlike other Argentine admirals and officials) is not enthusiastic about the Tupi deal as he believes the Tupis are far less capable/smaller than ARA Santa Cruz. Arosa also says he has is no idea of the true cost of repairing and refurbishing the Tupis.
The end of the Brazilian-Argenti
Pete
2 comments:
Pete,
IMO, I think Argentina should have walk right up to China or Russia and ask them about getting the Improved Kilo class SSK, the Yuan class Submarine. In fact if Argentina really wanted a new Military on the cheap, they gotten the JF-17, F/A-50 Golden Eagles, Type 054A frigate, Type 056 corvette or even the Type-035 Mings as well.
Sebastien Roblin, at The National Interest, June 23, 2019, has written an excellent article:
"How an Aircraft Carrier and a Submarine Hunted Each Other During the Falklands War"
https://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/how-aircraft-carrier-and-submarine-hunted-each-other-during-falklands-war-63657
Roblin details the superiority of the UK Royal Navy's nuclear attack submarines (SSNs) which severly limited the Argentine Navy's attempts to confront the UK amphibious force (that retook the Falkland Islands in 1982).
After UK SSN, HMS Conqueror, sunk the Argentine cruiser "General Belgrano", on May 2 1982, the captain of the Argentine aircraft carrier "Veinticino de Mayo":
"realized his taskforce now was on the verge of being annihilated by the Royal Navy’s quantitatively and qualitatively superior forces, so he turned Veinticinco westward and made full steam for the Argentinian coast..."
[On Australia's ongoing REGIONALLY SUPERIOR SUBMARINE http://www.defence.gov.au/Whitepaper/AtAGlance/Maritime-Ops.asp debate: I say the Falkland War experience clearly demonstrates that UK SSNs were regionally superior to the all conventional submarine force of Argentina. Just 2 Chinese SSNs (one per coast) could annihilate Australia's conventional navy in 2 days.]
See Sebastien Roblin's fine 2 page article at https://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/how-aircraft-carrier-and-submarine-hunted-each-other-during-falklands-war-63657
Pete
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