(Courtesy Saab), the following is an infographic, text and Youtube presentation of some Saab-Damen industrial plans to replace the Netherland's 4 Walrus submarines. Pete has added some background and comments in square [...] brackets.
"How the
Saab-Damen consortium will meet the Dutch requirement in replacing the Walrus
class
02 March 2019:
See larger, clearer infographic here.
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Saab and Dutch
shipbuilder Damen Shipyards Group [website] have joined forces to develop an
expeditionary submarine for the Netherland´s Walrus Replacement Programme
(WRES).
[Backgound on the Netherland's Walrus subs and replacement here. Pete comment - there will most likely be 4 Walrus replacement subs, (weighing 2,350 - 2,650 tons) in service in the early 2030s.]
[Backgound on the Netherland's Walrus subs and replacement here. Pete comment - there will most likely be 4 Walrus replacement subs, (weighing 2,350 - 2,650 tons) in service in the early 2030s.]
Take a look at the infographic above to get an overall
understanding of the various steps of the program, or watch the film below. The
production process will see sections made in Sweden and then assembled in
Vlissingen in the Netherlands.
3 minute Saab youtube published March 15, 2019.
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“Replacing the Walrus-class submarines requires a unique
approach. Swedish modular submarine design and production techniques coupled
with the Dutch shipbuilding tradition bring together the capabilities needed to
deliver an assured operational capability”, says Gunnar Wieslander, Senior Vice
President, head of business area Saab Kockums.
The Expeditionary Submarine builds on the
capabilities of the Swedish A26 [Saab is building 2 x A26s for the Swedish Navy - see some Saab details] combined with Dutch Submarine technology and
puts into practice the experience of the Dutch designed Walrus submarine
class and of the Swedish designed Collins-class submarine [Wiki] in-service with the
Australian Navy.
“The result of the collaboration will be a
customer-adapted submarine for expeditionary missions. This will ensure that
the Royal Netherlands Navy continues to play an important role in European
waters as well as globally”, says Hein van Ameijden, managing director of Damen
Schelde Naval Shipbuilding.
In addition, the Walrus replacement will also
benefit from the operational lessons reflected in the Swedish Navy’s Gotland [Mid Life Upgrade]. As a result the Expeditionary Submarine will be equipped with
state of the art technology whilst benefiting from de-risking on four submarine
classes. Saab and Damen are thereby creating one of the most modern [Saab ("Kockums") Stirling] Air
Independent Propulsion (AIP) submarines in the world, which if selected by the
Royal Netherlands navy, will be done in consultation with the customer using a
‘design to cost’ approach.
Having secured the cooperation of many Dutch
companies, Saab and Damen are set to enhance the domestic submarine competence.
This cooperation will also extend beyond the Dutch submarine project, as the
two companies see a growing market for this type of advanced conventional
submarines.
Both Saab and Damen are based in relatively
small countries, which means that both companies must naturally be extremely
good at collaboration to be able to operate successfully on an international
level; it almost seems to be embedded in the DNA of both organisations. This in
combination with a similar design philosophy based on cost-efficient quality
and adaptive modularity means that Saab-Kockums is a perfect partner within the
Dutch triple helix."
13 comments:
Hi Pete,
Maybe a litle update of the Gotland class mid-life upgrade is of interest, the title is something an Astralien didn't "understand" and removed Saab Kockums from the competion :)
It's easier to rebuild (in Swedish)
/Kjell
Thanks /Kjell
Regards
Pete
Hi Pete,
IMO, what the Dutch are really asking for is a non nuclear version of a Virginia class SSN. The current SSK's don't even come near the size of the Virginia class SSN.
Hi Pete
Winning bid by TKMS seems to be difficult based on various aspects [1-4]. I believe SAAB-Damen and Naval Group will go to the next stage, and eventually SAAB-Damen will win the bid.
[1] If SAAB-Damen is partially based on technology or knowhow of Collins (beam 7.8m), design of SAAB may be higher than Naval Group or TKMS(212CD) from the view point of experience.
[2] Reliability of AIP in both SAAB & TKMS (212CD) are reliable, SAAB-Damen (Stirling Gen: LOx and diesel oil) is better than 212CD (fuel cell: LOx and hydrogen) in availability of fuel/LOx for AIP, but efficiency of 212CD is higher than SAAB-Damen.
[3] In contribution to local industry of Netherlands, SAAB-Damen is better than Naval Group or TKMS, but, in the stability of builders, SAAB-Damen and Naval Group are higher than TKMS.
[4] SAAB-Damen, Naval Group and TKMS might use LIBs of SAFT.
Regards
Hi Nicky K.D Chaleunphone [18/3/19 10:27 PM]
The "Dutch are really asking for is a non nuclear version of a Virginia class SSN" rates high on the scale of novelty.
A non-nuclear Virginia would need to be similar to the the nuclear Virginia's size of 7,900 tonnes and complement/crew of 135. The Dutch are not searching for such enormities.
Regards
Pete
Hi Anonymous [at 19/3/19 5:07 AM]
Yes the TKMS 212's smaller size and high reliance on AIP seems to be Not what the Dutch want.
Also "small" Netherlands would not want to be politically or economically pressured by larger Germany (or perhaps France) in a future joint submarine making alliance.
Sweden being small might be a more acceptable partner for the Dutch.
Regards
Pete
Hi /Kjell
Regarding the Collins mid-life upgrade Shephard Media has published a short interesting article:
"Thales delivers first Collins-class sonar array" of 18th March 2019 at https://www.shephardmedia.com/news/imps-news/thales-uk-delivers-first-collins-class-replacement/
"Thales has completed the first of six new replacement bow sonar arrays on the Royal Australian Navy’s (RAN's) Collins-class submarines, the company announced on 11 March.
The company delivered the first bow sonar array to meet the RAN’s accelerated upgrade of HMAS Waller as part of a programme to extend the Collins-class submarine service life into the 2030s.
The Collins Sonar Capability Assurance Programme (CSCAP) is upgrading the capabilities of the six Collins submarines. The vessel’s current sonar has been in service since the 1980s. The new modular cylindrical array will provide enhanced sonar performance."
See the rest of the Shephard Media article at https://www.shephardmedia.com/news/imps-news/thales-uk-delivers-first-collins-class-replacement/
Nicky’s comments were maybe aimed at the SMX Ocean, here is a cut n paste from an article last year.
SMX-Ocean's combat capabilities, they mirror or even exceed those of the most modern nuclear attack subs of a similar size, and even larger in some cases. The SMX-Ocean boats are designed to pack vertical launch tubes for land and surface attack long-range cruise missiles and even anti-aircraft missiles. This is all in addition to the standard forward firing torpedo tubes, although these too are capable of deploying anti-ship, anti-sub and even anti-air weaponry. In total, this innovative new SSK design will be able to pack an incredible amount of firepower, totaling 34 missiles, mines or torpedoes. In comparison, the Virginia Class SSNs, which are nearly double displacement, carry 39 weapons.
So there “May” be considerable scope.
Hi Pete
As Naval Group is now concentrating to build Barracuda and design Attack-class [1], it does not seem to have enough capacity to design and buid submarines for Netherlands. In fact, Naval Group can earn a lot from Australia, is it undermotivated to win the bid of Warlus replacement?
I believe that Netherland and Sweden are very interested in the progress of Attack-class project and that SAAB-Damen will win the bid with a 99% possibility.
[1] http://gentleseas.blogspot.com/2019/03/france-least-efficient-attack-submarine.html
Regards
Lee and Nicky
SMX Ocean may be new to you, but its old news. Now bypassed.
You will note that I discussed the DCNS/Naval Group SMX Ocean paper concept submarine in 2014 and 2015.
Please read my articles of:
- October 30, 2014 https://gentleseas.blogspot.com/2014/10/frances-concept-smx-ocean-ssk-and-other.html
- October 31, 2014, France's DCNS Announces the SMX OCEAN large conventional submarine, https://gentleseas.blogspot.com/2014/10/revised-frances-dcns-announces-smx.html
and
- February 2, 2015 https://gentleseas.blogspot.com/2015/02/possible-australian-future-submarine.html which significant includes "DCNS SMX Ocean submarine being offered to Australia as the "conventional Barracuda""
Understand that in 2015 and 2016 Naval Group modified the SMX Ocean concept into the winning Shortfin Barracuda bid for the Australian future submarine compeitition.
Regards
Pete
Hi Anonymous [at 19/3/19 11:29 PM]
Regarding your "I believe that Netherland and Sweden are very interested in the progress of Attack-class project and that SAAB-Damen will win the bid with a 99% possibility."
Of course the Netherlands and Sweden were not in the short list for the Australian future submarine (SEA 1000) (now Attack class) competition in 2015-2016.
If Naval Group is unable to deliver the Attack class submarine (and that might only become obvious in the late 2020s) then Japan and TKMS Germany would likely be considered by Australia before the Netherlands and Sweden (Damen-Saab)
Regards
Pete
Pete
If Naval Group fail to deliver, I would put SAAB/Damen/ASC in front of Japan & TKMS, provided they get the Walrus replacement contract. The risks of going Japan have not changed (the actual builders are not interested & have never built anything overseas before). TKMS still have financial woes & their design is still a concept paper design. Part of Australia’s stated reason for dropping Kockums from the list was that they had not actually built a new submarine for years. A26 is now under construction & will be in the water before the late 2020’s. If SAAB Kockums win the Walrus replacement then they will have more than a concept design to put up. Damen seem to have inherited what is left of the Netherlands submarine industry, including sustainment (a bit like ASC). ASC has been involved also in this, along with SAAB & Damen. If we had to start again, especially considering lost time, it would be easiest to go SAAB/ASC.
Regards
Pete
[Comment now spread out for ease of reading]
If Naval Group fail to deliver, I would put SAAB/Damen/ASC in front of Japan & TKMS, provided they get the Walrus replacement contract.
The risks of going Japan have not changed (the actual builders are not interested & have never built anything overseas before).
TKMS still have financial woes & their design is still a concept paper design.
Part of Australia’s stated reason for dropping Kockums from the list was that they had not actually built a new submarine for years. A26 is now under construction & will be in the water before the late 2020’s.
If SAAB Kockums win the Walrus replacement then they will have more than a concept design to put up.
Damen seem to have inherited what is left of the Netherlands submarine industry, including sustainment (a bit like ASC). ASC has been involved also in this, along with SAAB & Damen.
If we had to start again, especially considering lost time, it would be easiest to go SAAB/ASC.
Regards
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